Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

AmigaOne X1000 platform specific issues.
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kilaueabart
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Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

Post by kilaueabart »

With help from people here and AmigaWorld.net, I had finally got early boot menu fixed up so I could choose between OS4FE and my 4.1.6 backup when booting.

I chose the more-ready-to-use backup and spent some happy time with e-mail and forums. I was somewhere between seventh heaven and cloud nine when I did the Ctrl-A-A thing, expecting that the higher-priority FE would come up. But no, back to 4.1.6! Perhaps the computer remembers what was chosen in the early boot menu and reboots it?

So I went to the delayed boot menu and selected FE by hand, and the screen just went black. After waiting quite some time I clicked the reset button on the X1000 and still the screen stayed black, except the "Check cable" thing started floating around on the monitor.

I tried several times, even shutting the computer down and waiting a while, but no good. I finally gave up in despair. This was late afternoon. I thought I'd get inside and check cables and board connections in the morning, but with didn't think would be likely to help; what could have happened to the machine in those few seconds?

Just before going to bed, I tried turning it on. And it came on quite as normal. This morning it came on again, and I am using it now.

I haven't been inside in a long time, and I should on general principles check for dust and such, but has anyone had an experience like this, or is anyone able to imagine what might have caused it?

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nbache
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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

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kilaueabart wrote:when I did the Ctrl-A-A thing, expecting that the higher-priority FE would come up. But no, back to 4.1.6! Perhaps the computer remembers what was chosen in the early boot menu and reboots it?
You need to do a cold reboot if you want a different Kickstart loaded. This is done with Ctrl-Alt-Alt. What you did with Ctrl-Amiga-Amiga was a warm reboot which keeps the current Kickstart loaded and just reboots Workbench.

Best regards,

Niels

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kilaueabart
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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

Post by kilaueabart »

I really thought the reset button on the X1000 would give me a cold reboot -- it always has. And certainly turning off for a few minutes and then on again should do it, but it did not yesterday. I had to wait hours.

I get a bit confused what keys are Alt and what are Amiga on this Logitek keyboard. It also seems to vary according to which version of the OS I boot. I think the R^Alt is sometimes Amiga, sometimes Alt. It's what I have been using to type accented letters, e.g. But I just tried it, and it seems to be pure R^Amiga at the moment. Earlier when I tried to copy with it, it gave a "c" with cedilla, wiping out what I wanted to copy.

I remember when computing was fun. :roll:

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nbache
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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

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kilaueabart wrote:I really thought the reset button on the X1000 would give me a cold reboot -- it always has.
Of course, but you wrote "when I did the Ctrl-A-A thing,", and (if by A you mean Amiga) that won't give you a cold reboot and thus load the system in the same Kickstart again.
I get a bit confused what keys are Alt and what are Amiga on this Logitek keyboard. It also seems to vary according to which version of the OS I boot.
Check the settings in Input prefs for each booted system, maybe they differ.

Also check whether you have the CFE variable keymap_swapaltamiga set to off or on.

Best regards,

Niels

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kilaueabart
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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

Post by kilaueabart »

Thanks for the hints. I guess I'm never going to be able to remember anymore what kind of useful things I can find in Prefs etc.

Mainly I'm here now to report that it happened again. I had been doing e-mail mostly for quite some time via YAM and Odyssey. Used Pha$ar to record some credit card use and was disconcerted to see how sloppy Pha$ar opens under FE. Just one of several pleasant and unpleasant surprises about how FE works this afternoon.

Then I was going to reboot into backup 4.1.6 to do some work with PageStream 5.0.5.8 Pro, which doesn't fully launch in FE. But I got the idea of trying to run it in FE first, then look at the ? file that keeps track of how far it got -- I've forgotten the simple everyday word that names such a file -- from 4.1.6 to see how far it got.

As usual, PgS sent two little windows -- tools and tool editor -- to the screen, then quit. This leaves the cursor moveable by mouse until I click on something, then everything freezes. Mouse and keyboard become unusable.

So, I clicked the reset button on that nifty box by my desk. And nothing! In view of the fact that I had been able to turn it on again the other day after leaving it off for several hours, I turned the power off and left it alone for about 15 minutes this time, then tried rebooting. Nothing.

I'm hoping that my previous experience will repeat, but I won't try until late this evening. Meanwhile, this is the first time I've ever been on an Amiga forum from my wi-fi tablet.

[Just after 8pm, same day] The X1000 revived again, after a few hours rest.

It almost seems like it might be a heating problem. Except for the fact that the weather has been unusually cool here lately, in the mid to upper seventies F. No problems the last year and a half when it was mostly in the upper 80s. But I will get inside and look around probably the day after tomorrow. I know CFE has a "show temp," which I've never tried, but the trick would be to get to that before the machine dies. I wonder if there's something that works in OS4.

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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

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kilaueabart wrote:It almost seems like it might be a heating problem. Except for the fact that the weather has been unusually cool here lately, in the mid to upper seventies F. No problems the last year and a half when it was mostly in the upper 80s. But I will get inside and look around probably the day after tomorrow. I know CFE has a "show temp," which I've never tried, but the trick would be to get to that before the machine dies. I wonder if there's something that works in OS4.
There is: The X1kTemp docky : http://os4depot.net/index.php?function= ... pdocky.lha

And yes, it does sound a bit like a heat problem, or possibly a (heat-induced?) connection problem.

When you get inside your machine (after disconnecting it completely from the mains, of course), make sure you remove all dust from cooling ribs and fans etc. Always make sure your inwards-blowing case fans have dust filters.

Also, make sure all cables and cards are firmly seated. A special point to note is that SATA cables can often be the cause of lots of connection-related failures; if you accidentally leave it just a little askew in the socket, it gives you an intermittent connection. The solution is to use SATA cables with locking clips on the plugs. They are not much more expensive and well worth that in saved hair-pulling.

Best regards,

Niels

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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

Post by danbeaver »

Those "locking" SATA cables do a poor job and that part of the SATA connection needs a re-design (or hot glue).

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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

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danbeaver wrote:Those "locking" SATA cables do a poor job
Not as poor as the standard SATA cable without a lock.

Best regards,

Niels

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kilaueabart
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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

Post by kilaueabart »

nbache wrote: ...
And yes, it does sound a bit like a heat problem, or possibly a (heat-induced?) connection problem.

When you get inside your machine (after disconnecting it completely from the mains, of course), make sure you remove all dust from cooling ribs and fans etc. Always make sure your inwards-blowing case fans have dust filters.

Also, make sure all cables and cards are firmly seated. ...
I guess there's no time like the present. It occurred to me that the reset button used to make the power light blink, but it doesn't now. Maybe the reset switch was broken? To test, I just now tried "Reboot" from OS4 Shell. And it didn't. Very discouraging.

It has to be coincidence that this only started after I installed OS4FE.

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kilaueabart
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Re: Big scare: X1000 died temporarily

Post by kilaueabart »

nbache wrote:
kilaueabart wrote:... I know CFE has a "show temp," which I've never tried, but the trick would be to get to that before the machine dies. I wonder if there's something that works in OS4.
There is: The X1kTemp docky : http://os4depot.net/index.php?function= ... pdocky.lha
Thanks. Once again the sort of thing I should have found myself.

Installed it. Once it was installed (first thing I did today) the readings were Case: 35 (Oops! Now where on earth is the degree sign?), CPU: 44, Core1: 48, and Core2: 46. About two hours later, CPU and Core1 have each gone up 1 degree C. Maybe heat is not the problem after all.
And yes, it does sound a bit like a heat problem, or possibly a (heat-induced?) connection problem.

When you get inside your machine (after disconnecting it completely from the mains, of course), make sure you remove all dust from cooling ribs and fans etc. Always make sure your inwards-blowing case fans have dust filters.

Also, make sure all cables and cards are firmly seated. A special point to note is that SATA cables can often be the cause of lots of connection-related failures; if you accidentally leave it just a little askew in the socket, it gives you an intermittent connection. The solution is to use SATA cables with locking clips on the plugs. They are not much more expensive and well worth that in saved hair-pulling.
I was astonished that the insides were still almost as clean as new. I detected dust under the DVD, enough that wiping it showed on a paper towel. Looked like some on the PSU top, but wiping left the paper towel clean. Looked like there might be some dust on the case fan blades, but not enough to make it worth removing it to clean.

I disconnected and reconnected a couple of the mysterious cables. I'm a bit timid about taking cables off if I didn't put them on myself and know how they work. Is brute force needed, or is there something to hold down or up?

Put it back together and booted, then Shelled "Reboot," and it did. Of course it hadn't heated up at all yet. When I finished all I had to do many hours later, I "Reboot"ed again, and this time it would not.

Still it seems to me on reflection that if heat is a problem, shouldn't it have effects on programs and applications that I run? Why is rebooting the only thing effected? Color me baffled.

Meanwhile I have discovered the Wiki, and
X1000 Won't Reboot Reliably

Turn off power to PSU.
Remove plug from PSU.
Remove power connector from the motherboard.
Take out one RAM card leaving only one to the right of the PA6T CPU (i.e. 3rd slot from the left).
While the RAM card is out check the slots 2 & 3 for dust build up (the CPU fan blows dust onto them) and use a small clean brush to remove it.
Plug power connector back on to the motherboard.
Connect PSU power & switch on PSU.
Turn on X1000.
If the X1000 boots up to Workbench, press and hold the power button for 3-5 seconds & it should shut off.
I don't understand two of those steps. I didn't see any plug to the PSU, and if I leave RAM card 3 in, can I really check for dust? But I'll try as many of those as I can shortly.

Right now I'm going to give it the old reboot and watch TV for an hour. I wonder how long I will have to wait before I really can turn it on again.
-------------------------------------------------------------
OMGorsh! It looks like one of those lovely Intermittents! It rebooted just fine. This time I chose 416 (had been FE) so I can use PageStream, but didn't expect it to come up. 1:17 later (having added X1KTemp to 461 as well), 35, 45, 50(!), 47.

I don't like Intermittents!

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