New Simulant Amiga "classic" USB PC keyboard and drivers

[simulant]

Hi, sorry to bother you.

I'm behind the newly produced Amiga mechanical USB keyboards project (https://www.simulant.uk/shop/amiga-clas ... l-keyboard). I've been using and testing the keyboard with my own X5000 without problems so far.

However, a backer of the project received his keyboard today and is having a few problems with the keyboard being recognised (I'm not sure if it's down to me using a USB active hub, or different BIOS/OS drivers on my machine, so this is hard to debug.)

He can get the keyboard to work, but he is having to unplug and re-plug it in after OS4 boots.

Can you help at all to get the keyboard working better for him - and any other future users who may have the issue?

Thanks and best wishes,

Jonah

[rjd324]

Hello, I am the backer.

AmigaOS version: latest
Firmware: molsen 2018-10-05

Use Case 1:

- Keyboard plugged into top left rear USB port (yes, I know this is not the X1000 where the keyboard had to be plugged in that location, but I like it that way - and, in anycase, the same symptoms apply regardless of where the keyboard is plugged; though, I have not tried a HUB, but plugging it into a HUB should definitely not be a requirement).
- Boot from cold into WB
- No activity from keyboard, other than green NUM light
- Open SysMon/devices (two entries)
Gaming Keyboard / 3-1 (Human interface) / bootkeyboard.usbfd / 0x040b
Gaming Keyboard / 3-1 (Human interface) / bootkeyboard.usbfd / 0x040b
- Hot-unplug-plug the keyboard back into the same port
- Refresh SysMon/devices (two entries)
Gaming Keyboard / 3-1 (Human interface) / hid.usbfd / 0x040b
Gaming Keyboard / 3-1 (Human interface) / hid.usbfd / 0x040b
- Notice that after a hot-unplug-plug the keyboard now works

Use Case 2:

- With no keyboard attached anywhere, boot from cold
- Plug keyboard in
- Working fine.
- Notice that SysMon/devices reports:
Gaming Keyboard / 3-1 (Human interface) / hid.usbfd / 0x040b
Gaming Keyboard / 3-1 (Human interface) / hid.usbfd / 0x040b

Suspected cause of issue:
bootkeyboard.usbfd is being used to drive the keyboard when it is detected when it is plugged in from cold boot.

[rjd324]

Also, from cold boot with keyboard plugged in; able to get to boot menu but get a stream of:

"Timeout poll on interrupt endpoint" messages and glitches on the drawing of the menus. Responds to up and down, but the menus is all garbled.

Does the keyboard require the "boot" driver first at startup, then switch over to hid?

[rjd324]

Additionally, a separate mechanical keyboard I have: Filco - does not show any of these problems and just works.

[nbache]

@rjd324 (& @simulant):

Did you see this (sub-)thread: https://www.amigans.net/modules/newbb/v ... post135819

I know you don't state anything about using a KVM switch, but maybe the same trick (adding a passive USB hub) can be used also without that.

And yes, in an ideal world, things would just work without having to use a USB hub, but given the low price of such a hub, it could be worth a try.

From the descriptions on Simulant's page, I'm not sure if this keyboard has some extra "trickery" built in which could make it more sensitive to the timing details of the X5k during startup or whatever. I do see the mention of firmware.

Best regards,

Niels

[rjd324]

Okay thanks for that. I responded to that thread. For anyone interested I guess read this thread and that thread.

[simulant]

From the descriptions on Simulant's page, I'm not sure if this keyboard has some extra "trickery" built in which could make it more sensitive to the timing details of the X5k during startup or whatever. I do see the mention of firmware.

Hi thanks for the reply. I'm happy to work with you if you need extra details. I didn't create the firmware and this was down the factory who made our products but there shouldn't be any non-standard trickery etc throwing things off - it's a standard HID USB device and has been tested on quite a lot of other devices.

We do have an adaptor for classic Amiga use, but this works simply by unplugging the internal USB wire inside, fitting the adaptor in the case, then running a normal PS/2 style DIN plug out so it can work with 68K big box machines etc. This is added, and not part of the keyboard so doesn't change anything for X5000.

Hopefully if there is anything non-standard we have to patch or apply I can provide any debug information you may need? Is there a way to use the HID driver from boot as rjd suggests?

[nbache]

@Simulant

I don't know anything relevant about the USB drivers except for the small experiments detailed in the referred thread. I'm just a beta tester.

But in the past I've noticed (on various NG Amigas) that the simpler, more basic a keyboard is, the greater the chance is that it works without problems with OS4 (and UBoot/CFE). That's the only reason I mentioned "trickery" (sorry if that term seemed negative, that wasn't intended) and firmware.

Best regards,

Niels

[rjd324]

Okay. TearsOfMe suggested removing the "bootkeyboard.usbfd" module out of "kicklayout". This actually works. Now when entering WB and looking at SysMon, the keyboard is using the HID.

On top of that, I can STILL navigate and get into the boot menu screen anyway - as if "bootkeyboard.usbfd" had no effect at all. For now, it remains commented out in my kicklayout.

I am at the point where the only issue with this keyboard now is that in the boot menu I keep on getting the "poll" error I mentioned above but I can still actually navigate the menu (it is still glitchy though). I can go into the command line and still type commands but the "poll" output makes things difficult to read.

Good progress. That is where we are right now.

I have tried this KB only for a minute or so on my X1000 so I might come back to report more information on that; it did not seem to be working fully there, but I use VNC to get into the X1000 anyway. However, it could be beneficial for Simu / the community to detail any issues.